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 The Lycaeum Forums » Psychedelics & Non Visionary Related » Visionary Chemicals (Moderator: 2a)Topic:
 Aliens on LSD

[whateveryouwantmetobe]

It makes us feel smug to try and control and own nature.

Perhaps.  Then again what the hell else are we supposed to do with all this time and intelligence we have in our hands?

[x]

Perhaps.  Then again what the hell else are we supposed to do with all this time and intelligence we have in our hands?

Not this.

Go and plant some potatoes.

Go plant a tree that is indigenous to your area.

Go for a hike and smoke a spliff.

Have a wank.

[2a]

so horticulture and drug use don't require some level of understanding and control of nature?  Pardon me if I'm mistaken, but that seems contradictory to your previous statements.

[x]

so horticulture and drug use don't require some level of understanding and control of nature?  Pardon me if I'm mistaken, but that seems contradictory to your previous statements.

[x]

Man has a poor understanding of life. He mistakes knowledge for wisdom. He tries to unveil the Holy secrets of our Father. The Great Spirit. He attempts to impose his laws and ways on Mother Nature.

Even though he, himself, is part of nature, he chooses to disregard and ignore it, for the sake of his own immediate gain.

But the laws of nature are much stronger than those of mankind.

Man must awake at last, and learn to understand how little time there remains before he will become the cause of his own downfall.

And he has so much to learn. To learn to see with the heart.

He must learn to respect Mother Earth - She who has given life to everything, to our Brothers and Sisters, the Animals and the Plants, to the rivers, the lakes, the oceans, and the winds.

He must realise that this planet does not belong to him.
But he must care for and maitain the delicate balance of Nature, for the sake of the wellbeing of our children and of all future generations.

It is the duty of Man to preserve the Earth, and the creation of the Great Spirit, Mankind being just a grain of sand in the Holy Circle which encloses all life.

White Cloud.

[pylkko]

Here's a nice essay titled "Why solipsism is Bullshit" which is a philosophical approach to disproving solipsism.
http://www.phy.duke.edu/~rgb/Philosophy/axioms/axioms/node43.html

I personally take the biological approach to disproving solipsism.  Every living organisms has parents, and each parent has parents, and those parents had parents of their own.  How could two mindless organisms produce a being with a mind?  And if this organism with a mind reproduced, would their offspring have a mind?  My assumption is yes.  The fact that every organism on this planet shares a common ancestor suggests that there are multiple beings on this planet with a mind.

Physically, I can know that objects exist outside of the mind because I can see, smell, touch, hear, or taste objects that are not part of my body.  That, and the fact that multiple minds can come to an agreement about certain physical properties of the universe suggests that other beings have minds and undergo the same mental processes as I do.  Granted, I doubt that any other organism on this planet uses their brain in an identical way that I do, but the processes are still similar.

I guess I can never be 100% certain that anything exists outside of my mind.  However, I am more than 99.999% sure that things exist outside my mind, which for me is a strong enough certainty to assume that things exist outside my mind.

I hope you realize that he was nowhere supporting solipsism, that it was brought against him as a strawman?

[x]

I hope you realize that he was nowhere supporting solipsism, that it was brought against him as a strawman?

Your a smart guy and some one you wanna have in your corner, cheers, are you a lawyer, lol.

[farmerjack]

Even though he, himself, is part of nature, he chooses to disregard and ignore it, for the sake of his own immediate gain.

But the laws of nature are much stronger than those of mankind

Nature, to be commanded, must be obeyed.

[Newfound_wonder]

I hope you realize that he was nowhere supporting solipsism , that it was brought against him as a strawman?

I don't care; I have a big-time beef with solipsism (I failed a philosophy exam because of it) and like attacking the idea whenever I have the chance.   

Die solipsism, DIE!

[Noman]

Once on Aya, I asked who or whatever seemed to be in charge at the time (that's pretty much my definition of God), what of what I was experiencing was real or the product of my mind and it answered "what's the difference?".
I think the real astonishment in serious psychedelic experience is that utter dropping away and abrupt invalidation of the subjective/objective.
The traveler starts at this point rather than coming to it as a conclusion.

[gorfehttimrek]

Maybe not control of nature, but control of natures effect over us.  Building shelter, fire, roads and bridges are all ways of bringing nature under our control.

[hermes]

All of this man controlling nature stuff misses the obvious fact that man IS a force of nature. Saying that man shouldn't alter anything is like saying that it is artificial for snails to make shells or for badgers to dig holes or beavers to make dams. Every organism manipulates its environment for its own sake to some extent. This is what life does. Everything is natural, even Twinkies and fake tits. Consider how even the body of an organism is a technology of sorts. Biology is a kind of technology. And it is a very systematic way of rearranging the elements in the environment to make something highly organized out of them. It is simply an organizational process. A city is no different in this respect than the body of a sparrow. In both cases, life is self-organizing, taking the materials and arranging them into information processing, evolving systems. Manhattan evolved out of the slime and dust just like a termite mound or a beehive. You might go so far as to say that collections of human beings are in fact coherent organisms themselves. Societies are superorganisms, just like our body is a society of cells. There are many parallels between a body and a society. You might say that laying asphalt is unnatural or that building concrete structures is unnatural. How is that any different from the cells in your body taking materials from your environment and making bones and ligaments and blood vessels?

The artificial versus natural distinction represents a fundamental misunderstanding of the world and our relation to it.

If cities shouldn't be built and there should be no technology, then maybe life is an unnatural violation of the pristine, "natural", "unspoiled" sterility of a lifeless planet. Maybe the organization that is a galaxy, with all the stars and planets, is itself a violation of the pristine uniformity of the quark-gluon plasma that filled the universe at some point shortly after the Big Bang. Maybe bumblebees and elephants are disgusting, resource hungry, hydrocarbon belching machines that shouldn't exist. Maybe DNA should relax its tyranny over the rocks and gases and dirt of this once pure and unoppressed planet. Maybe nothing should organize. Maybe an undifferentiated, formless void is the only purity, the only natural thing. Maybe the organizing principle, whatever it is, should just leave the void alone, that smug and controlling asshole!

Notice how plants and animals alter the gas composition of the atmosphere selfishly to make the environment more to their liking. How horrible! They should leave it alone and stop trying to play God! Where does life get off altering all these chemicals and assembling all of these unnatural compounds and dangerous replicators? Making proteins! The horror! Just look around. You can hardly see the planet anymore with all of this bio-trash all over it! And look at how the plants erode the rocks! The damage that will never be undone!!!!  All of these plants and animals have so thoroughly polluted this planet that you can see the effects from space! Some parts of the planet are green as seen from space! We should protest the forests! How dare they steal the nutrients in the soil and erect those ungodly towering structures that interfere with the wind and eat up all the sunlight!   

[x]

"He mistakes knowledge for wisdom"

What does that line mean I wonder?

Knowledge is going on and on about things, trying to win an arguement that doesn't exist.

Wisdom is knowing when to give up looking and just start being.

Being right here on Mother Earth, in peace.

And peace aint the hippy cliche most think.

Peace is knowing the answer, and not thinking too hard about how one was to explain it.

It is a feeling, an emotion, love, and wisdom. It dwells in the heart.

But one must come from wisdom to know wisdom.

Much like one must come from knowledge to know knowledge.

James White Cloud, was from Iowa, that is his peoples land.

[Govindaze]

Once on Aya, I asked who or whatever seemed to be in charge at the time (that's pretty much my definition of God), what of what I was experiencing was real or the product of my mind and it answered "what's the difference?".
I think the real astonishment in serious psychedelic experience is that utter dropping away and abrupt invalidation of the subjective/objective.
The traveler starts at this point rather than coming to it as a conclusion.

 Thanks for saying this. It reminded me of a very important message received during a similarly fueled journey. The " No Boundary " moment. 

[Papyrifera]

But seriously has anyine else come across a batch of LSD with a picture of a little green alien on them. 'Bout ten years ago.

One has had some purple alien heads, not that long ago. Four years maybe? They were pretty bunk, one ate five of them and only barely tripped out. Also the effect was very long lived, and one suspected they were possibly a DO-x compound and not LSD at all.

Had an experience walking home after a Tool concert, after consuming 1 hit of acid and about 1.5 grams of mushrooms. This little gnome/elf like entity was standing in the park, and when I saw him he grinned mischieviously, and pointed a small device at me. I seemed to have been frozen in my tracks, or time slowed down considerably. I remember, I was trying to keep walking home but it was like walking through molasses, I was moving at a snails pace and with great effort. Then I blacked out, my next memory is of being home but with no recollection of the rest of the walk. Funny experience, that 

[rhodopsin]

LOL! ™

[vampirebunnies]

All of this man controlling nature stuff misses the obvious fact that man IS a force of nature. Saying that man shouldn't alter anything is like saying that it is artificial for snails to make shells or for badgers to dig holes or beavers to make dams. Every organism manipulates its environment for its own sake to some extent. This is what life does. Everything is natural, even Twinkies and fake tits.

The artificial versus natural distinction represents a fundamental misunderstanding of the world and our relation to it.

Thank You!   I've been saying that for years.  I once saw a gas station sign poking up out of the rural landscape and thought, well, that is different, but it is still nature.  How could anything on Earth be "not nature?"

Alien encounters seem to be (in my current opinion) a psychological event that stems from our collective guilt over what we do to animals.  Such as "abducting" creatures from their natural environment and "experimenting" on them much like the archetypal abduction story that people experience.

That doesn't mean I totally believe that aliens are "all in your head."  It is still possible that there are external entities operating on a level accessible only in altered states, or even possibly that they physically come here from another world and interact with people from Texas or people on LSD. 

[vampirebunnies]

I can name at least five moderately famous DJs who claim to be aliens sent to Earth to enact peace through dance...

There are a group of people around here like that.  They are walk-in alien beings who regularly enact a ritual to contact their space ship by building a big ass fire in the middle of the dance floor (and yelling at people who try to roast marshmallows or hotdogs in it.)  They are for real though.  I saw them once through the filter of psychedelic reality and they are not human. I can't claim to understand their mission or what they are doing but watching them in action it seems important. 

[Moo]

Hermes!  I like it man -- even fake tits ARE natural.

Have you read The World Without Us?