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 The Lycaeum Forums » Psychedelics & Non Visionary Related » Visionary Plants (Moderators: Papyrifera, Noman)Topic:
 Nymphaea vs. Nelumbo; Exploring the Sacred Lotus

[DrYRHead]

It sounds tasty too.

[Papyrifera]

Nymphaea versus Nelumbo, revisited:

At the beginning of this thread I noted that Nelumbo nucifera (sacred lotus) is more potent than Nymphaea caerulea (blue lotus). It might be better to say there is a qualitative difference between the two. Nelumbo is more strongly psychoactive, giving sensations of floating, mild euphoria and a deep stoniness when smoked or chewed. Nymphaea has more of a sedating, calming effect, softening all your rough edges. Both types of lotus are valuable.

However... there are bad batches of Nelumbo out there. I got Nelumbo nucifera stamens twice from the same source, the first batch was weak and I questioned my rating of Nelumbo as the more potent of the two. The second batch I got from this source was very potent, just a pinch added to a joint or chewed was enough for a strong effect. The good batch was a little darker yellow and more aromatic.

[farmerjack]

How very timely.

I just spent two days at the family compound in midstate Michigan. It's located on an inland lake choked with what we call lilley pads around here. The lilly flowers are yellow outside with white petals and dark stamen(?).

They are illegal to pick/harvest in michigan but I watched a near collision in a canal which forced one boat into a raft of these lillys and several got seperated from their roots.

Did I make a mistake by not scooping those things up?

[Papyrifera]

Yes. They are Nelumbo lutea and pretty psychoactive. I guess the North American Nelumbo lutea is endangered in areas, but locally abundant, even weedy, in others.

[farmerjack]

yessir, weedy they are this year. I've never seen so many in the forty years I've been hanging around that lake. Maybe 7or 8 X the normal number over the years. I'll keep my eyes open for further aquatic accidents.

[Papyrifera]

We have been exploring lotus tea for its potent effects on dreaming. We have been using mostly blue lotus (Nymphaea caerulea) or sometimes a mixture of blue and sacred lotus (Nelumbo nucifera). The main effects we have noticed are an increase in dream frequency (or at least, recollection of dreams), and also that the dreams become more vivid or life-like. It starts to feel more like everyday waking consciousness, when dreaming. The dreams are very detailed and vivid, seeming more "real" than most dreams.

Last night we tried a new mixture, blue and sacred lotus plus guayusa (Ilex guayusa), which is a wild-growing relative of yerba mate (Ilex paraguariensis). Guayusa has been tested to have the highest caffeine content of any plant (up to 8.4% dry weight!), and yet surprisingly the traditional use of this plant is to take a strong tea just before bedtime to enhance dreaming. It is likely that the caffeine in guayusa is in bound forms, which release slowly into the body and thus the plant is energizing but does not inhibit sleep as with coffee or black tea (containing mostly unbound caffeine). This is something we have noticed with yerba mate also, many times I have swilled down a strong cup of mate and then gone straight to sleep, sometimes noticing that I have more vivid dreams.

The guayusa added an interesting taste to the earthy taste of lotus, it had a cooling effect akin to mint and a mild numbing of the throat reminiscent of coca or nettle tea. Unlike yerba mate, guayusa has a very low tannin content so there was no bitterness to the tea even after a prolonged steeping. I felt a little energized from the guayusa, conversation was stimulated for sure. After an hour and a half we went to bed, feeling sleepy.

I had a good sleep and my dreams were very intricate and vivid. I was in a port city in America somewhere, down by the harbour. I had been sent to find a man who worked at a local highschool, on the third floor in room 43. I found the school (entrance from the busy street by the harbour) and walked up to the third floor, but exited the wrong way. There was another street at the top of the school, which was built into a cliff overlooking the harbour. I hung out in a sunny courtyard area with a bunch of students for awhile, then went back into the school to find room 43. I went down the whole hallway, the numbers did not follow a logical order like most buildings, but eventually I found room 43 and knocked sharply. There was no answer at first, so I went to knock again and a man opened the door brandishing a fire extinguisher. I put my hands up defensively, but when he saw my face he relaxed, knowing who I was. We went inside to talk, but at that moment I woke up. My partner reports vivid dreams also.

Anyone interesting in exploring dream states or "dream tripping" may wish to work with lotus tea. Adding the guayusa seemed a good experience for us, and we will likely explore this combination more in the future. Happy dreaming!

[DrYRHead]

One has found that blue lotus mixed well with mugwort in a oneirogenic(dream enhancing) tea blend.

[Papyrifera]

NELUMBO NUCIFERA leaf material

This stuff is cheap, I think I got a pound for less than $10. It definitely has mild sedative properties. We have only made it into tea, have not tried other methods of ingestion. Drinking the tea makes me feel kind of drowsy and calm. Not strong by any means, but if you just want a relaxing tea before bedtime, then its good stuff.

[fat bunnies]

If one were thinking about experimenting with smoking Nelumbo Nucifera should one smoke just the pedals or just the stamens or a combination of both? Is this plant best smoked using a pipe or in joint form?

[Papyrifera]

Petals and stamens both work fine. The stamens are supposedly the most potent part, but one has gotten bad batches of stamens before so watch out. Good batches are pretty fragrant and retain some colour. If smoking on its own one would usually use a pipe, joints roll a little loose and burn hot unless it is a 50/50 mix with weed. Usually mixing with weed is the way one prefers to enjoy lotus.

[DrYRHead]

I was about to say that too. The stamens go better in a pipe, but the petals roll good in a joint form.